Talk: Shimmer

Infobox

I removed several spoiler protected entries from Shimmer's infobox with some hesitation so I figured I'd see if anyone had any opinions on the topic. I feel we should generally avoid turning the infobox into a resume/CV of every occupation and affiliation the person has ever had. It should be more a snapshot of who the person is when they are introduced in the series and perhaps include additions as the books move along. I think multiple (and especially contradictory entries) just serve to confuse.

I'm also not a big fan of spoilered out entries in the Infoboxes. The spoiler tags were added as a stopgap measure until some better idea came along. But as we later found out, they don't work in mobile.--ArchieVist (talk) 14:47, February 2, 2020 (UTC)

I've thought that the Shimmer/Iko issue was going to be difficult to address ever since DL & KR were published. It is mentioned in BB - in a blink and you miss it section - that Shimmer was called "Iko" - twice - by her father when she was a young child but only on the one occasion and in a daydreamy flashback. As far as I know that's the only time the 'Crimson Guard Shimmer' is referred to as Iko. The name "Iko" is then not mentioned again until DL.

Iko is referred to as "Shimmer" (as a nickname) in DL. In KR Iko is called "Shimmer" by the boy-king, Chulalorn the Fourth once, and never by anyone else in KR. In fact, during the whole last section of KR in which Iko appears, she is referred to as "Iko" throughout.

My point is that with other characters these mentions might be covered in a "Trivia" section and left at that. But with the Shimmer page, it's essentially 'etched in stone' in the infobox - which - by its nature - is probably the first thing that a reader notices when looking at the page and carries a 'this is canon' feel about it. I would prefer to see the Shimmer (as Crimson Guard) page and the - still to be fleshed out - Iko (as whipsword dancer) page as two separate articles. They could both then have an "Alias Spoiler Alert" section added to the end of their pages - Iko already has one. They would not even be "Speculations", as it is clear that the same woman is both Shimmer and Iko, but in very different times/situations of her life.

Then there is the single reference in RCG to Shimmer/Iko as having eyes that were as blue-Napan as her face. This strikes me as being more likely a continuity issue - it seems unlikely that someone with Napan blood would show up - as a young child - on a "farm in one of the more rural Kan provinces", although possible, of course. And this blue complexion is then never referred to elsewhere - very strange.

Well, I'll stop. The bottom line is that I agree with what you said above, AV. I think that the infoboxes - being so attention-getting - should include only the basic facts from when we first are introduced to the character. The other material could/should be included elsewhere in the article: the intro; the book section in which it is mentioned; or a "Trivia", "Speculation" or "Continuity" section. If material seems to need to be blanked-out as a spoiler, then perhaps it shouldn't appear in the infobox, particularly since a surprising number of people read the wiki on their mobile phones - the majority, according to a poll that Egwene once ran.

Sorry to be so long-winded but this has been on my mind for some time. Pcwrcw (talk) 05:37, February 3, 2020 (UTC)

Joining the chorus line. Have been uneasy about spoilers in infoboxes, too, for a long time for the sole reason Pcwrcw has mentioned - they are visible in mobile view. Maybe we could add a line to the template instead: ‘Information containing potential spoilers is omitted from infoboxes’?Egwene of the Malazan Empire (talk) 08:51, February 3, 2020 (UTC)

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